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okay please forgive the primitive nature

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of my presentation technology this is

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poor person's powerpoint otherwise known

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as word and you see my affiliation and

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the title of my talk philosophical

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substance-abuse distorting Descartes and

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dismissing dualism I'm going to try to

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come to the defense of Rene Descartes

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and we learned recently that I may be

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able to make him feel better in his time

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by going backwards myself so

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consciousness what is it we don't really

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know and yet we all have it the

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mind-body problem what is that well

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that's deeply related to the question of

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what is consciousness and where does

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consciousness originate the mind-body

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problem is the question of what is the

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relationship between mind and body does

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body create mind or is there something

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else going on and to the major

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historical points of view our first

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dualism the idea that mind is primary

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independent not physical and does not

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die with the body and does not depend on

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the body for its existence

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this was the predominant view of

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philosophers and everybody on the planet

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for a very long time according to popper

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and Eccles but as scientists began to

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construct the scientific method and

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science advanced over time dualism

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started to lose its respect and in fact

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ironically it was Rene Descartes that

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helped lead to the demise of dualism

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even though he was one of its primary

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proponents the idea that Rob rose

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instead of dualism was materialism which

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an earlier speaker called physicalism

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and that's really essentially the same

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thing the idea that the mind is a

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product of the living brain and ceases

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to exist when the brain meets its death

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dualism in philosophical and

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psychological service circles has been

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beaten to death and buried it no longer

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is viable it is over anyone who believes

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in dualism at best is deluded and so

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des cartes view of substance from his

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meditations on First Philosophy this is

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something that I think the physicalist

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should read so that they know what it is

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they're denying and denouncing before

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they do it Rene Descartes had several

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ideas had in his idea in his mind trying

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to distinguish between mind and body

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he said that both mind and body are

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substances what is the substance it's a

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thing that's capable of existing

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independently I found that a rather

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oblique definition when I first started

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studying this but lately I started to

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understand when I heard some ideas about

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from Aristotle an example of a non

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substance would be a shadow a shadow

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requires a source of light and an object

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it does not exist independently it

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cannot exist without those things but

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the source of light and the object can't

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exist without the shadow and can exist

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independently so they would be made of a

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substance third the cart said that the

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mind is a thinking and non extended

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substance and here's where he started to

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get into trouble with his third sentence

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whereas the body is non thinking and

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extended what did he mean by extension

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well it's rather complicated I don't

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have the time to stand here and read all

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the quotes that I provide I'm hoping

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that you're scanning those as I talk but

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his idea of extension included the idea

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that two things with extension cannot

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occupy the same physical space that is

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the exclusionary occupation of space by

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matter which is a well-known principle

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in physics and accordingly he said it is

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certain that I am really distinct from

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my body

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and can exist without it and that's a

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point-blank statement of dualism v he

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defined an extended such substances

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having three dimensions with shape and

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motion the body as an extended substance

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also has the property of exclusionary

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occupation of space as I was just saying

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7th mind and body differ further in that

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body is divisible physically it can be

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cut apart where his mind he says is

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utterly indivisible and by

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he means with physical means like knives

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or whatever and then lastly the human

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body is an interactive union of mind and

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body and here's another place he got

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himself in trouble because he could not

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explain how the interaction occurs and

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this above all else has been cited as a

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reason why it's obvious the dualism is

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false so objections there are many I

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just picked one because it's the usual

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objection and it's what I just stated if

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the brain is physical and the mind is

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non-physical then how can the brain and

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the mind interact this is posed as a

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rhetorical question a question would the

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answer already incorporated into it by

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using the term non-physical this way the

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person asking such a question is

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implicitly defining a non-physical

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entity as not able to interact with a

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physical entity that's what makes it

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non-physical and so the question

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contains the answer and we're supposed

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to say oh you're right it's over there

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is no interactionism there is no duality

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there is no dualism well that's a bit of

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taking Descartes too far in my opinion

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and materialists have been at this for

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centuries picking on foreign aid to cart

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and he they have exaggerated and

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sharpened the other distinctions that he

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made into a description of the

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non-physical substance as something

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that's really untenable the non-physical

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mind has neither mass nor energy is not

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localizable in any way in space is not

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extended in space does not exist in

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space has no physical properties

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whatsoever has nothing in common with

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physical things and is completely

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independent of anything material and

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works independently of the brain okay

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that's too much they've gone over the

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ledge here and to tell an interactionist

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that his point of view is that the mind

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works independently of the brain is to

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not listen when the guy says I'm an

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interactionist so no this is not what

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they cart thought however it's become

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the way he's described my objection if

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the body and the mind both fit the

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definition of substance according to

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Descartes who

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the term to describe things that are

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substantial in these two examples of

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substances must share some common

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properties that is the definition of

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substance they both have to meet that

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definition and this point seems to have

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escaped the physicalist materialist

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thinkers so how do we gain traction on

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such a slippery problem how do we

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approach the idea and and generate some

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ideas about what exactly could another

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subsides matter B and mean so we need

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some empirical data and we also need

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some theoretical help and I'm going to

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ask Albert Einstein for help today and

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I'm going to with apologies ask Brian

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Green for some help he was here last

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weekend for the I scene conference and

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he was shall we say not exactly

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intrigued by my ideas and so I apologize

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to him here my invoking him in this talk

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if he were here he would be outraged and

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I'm sorry he's not here what do I call

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empirical data here's where I get myself

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in even more trouble the near-death

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experience most of you have probably

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heard of this this occurs usually when a

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person comes close to physical death or

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actually physically dies and isn't

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resuscitated there are many many

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thousands bordering well there are

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millions of people who have claimed to

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have the experience and in many

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thousands of published reports and I

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could talk to you for seven or eight

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hours on the phenomenon alone but I've

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picked two reports that illustrate one

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principle that's really critical to what

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I have to tell you at the end of the

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talk these are reports in the operating

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room of people who died on the table and

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were resuscitated and then told their

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stories later on and the first person

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says as they that is the doctors and

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nurses came by they wouldn't seem to

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notice me they would just keep walking

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with their eyes straight ahead

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and this is the person who's dissociated

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from his or her body and observing

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what's going on in the operating room as

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they came real close I would try to turn

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around

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to get out of their way but they would

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just walk through me hmm okay you're

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entitled to say okay these people are

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psychotic however I spent my entire

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master's thesis showing that they

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weren't so I'll mail it to you if you

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need a reason the second account I'm

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trying to stop them the doctors I really

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did try to grab ahold of them and stop

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them because I really felt happy where I

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was which is dead

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I actually remember grabbing the doctor

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the interviewer asked what happened the

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the experiencer says nothing absolutely

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nothing it was almost like he wasn't

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there well he was there and so was the

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experiencer but they were different

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somehow aren't they and in fact there's

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a superposition of the experience there

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over physical bodies with no interaction

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so I'm gonna have to accelerate myself

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way beyond my normal range consider

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Einstein's famous equation with a whole

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bunch of changes e equals s sub I seats

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of the I where I is an integer zero to

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whatever s 0 would be energy itself

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since C to the 0 is 1 s 1 would be what

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I'm calling essence the non-material

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speaking substance s 2 would be matter

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this is just for illustration purposes

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you can think of a way to construct a

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substance from energy that is not

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mattered simply by considering such a

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simple relationship so the essence that

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I call the non material substance would

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be constructed completely differently

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from energy it would still be

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constructed from energy but differently

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so differently that it could overlap

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with matter and not even interact with

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it except under certain circumstances

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Einstein has helped us understand with

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his a equals M c-squared equation that

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there could be other forms of substance

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but he hasn't given us any kind of

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structural advice so let's turn to Brian

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Greene and as you see here string theory

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comes directly from Newtonian mechanics

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because in the upper left-hand corner we

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have Newton's apple and Newton didn't

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know it at the time because Apple was

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composed of many Apple atoms

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and each Apple atom has what were once

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called elementary particles electrons

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protons neutrons those have been shown

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to consist of quarks string theory has

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told us that the quarks themselves are

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composed of strings strings are supposed

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to be the fundamental unit of everything

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and so string theory is a grand

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unification theory in the sense that

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Einstein wanted however this is an

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artists misconception because material

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particles are open-ended strings and

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what he's shown here is a closed-ended

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string so this is not drawn quite right

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however we're going to go ahead what are

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things in terms of strings closed loop

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strings are one type these are

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free-floating tiny vibrating circular

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strands of energy the open-ended strings

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are the other type these are bound to

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our support additional spacetime three

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physical space will dimensions one time

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dimension at each end so the opening of

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strings are actually part of our

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universe what string theory claims is

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that different amounts of energy are

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represented by different vibrational

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modes of the strings translating to

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different masses of particles

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gravitons predicted by relativity are in

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string theory closed loop strings that

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only temporarily stay in this universe

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and then leave it so string theory is

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meant to account for the weakness of

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gravity by saying that most gravitons

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never exert any force on a physical

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object they leave the universe first and

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that's one of the strengths of string

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theory but how do we test it no one's

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been able to test it I suggest to you

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that the near-death experience

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represents the test of this theory that

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the what I call the essence the

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dissociated non material mind is in fact

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a closed loop string or maybe more than

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one closed loop string that allows its

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overlap with matter because the closed

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loop string is not attached to

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space-time and secondly to be even more

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outrageous consciousness is in the

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closed loop string although not

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necessarily originating from it and

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maybe vice versa I suspect and the

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closed loop string that is the essence

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as I call it the human mind is cable

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of leaving the universe and if that's

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not renegade enough for you

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my apologies therefore I believe that

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the old ideas of Rene Descartes about

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substance have been given a new life a

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new way of thinking about them at the

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very least and a new way of gathering

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information by using human experience

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subjective experience as scientific data

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in the area of consciousness I really

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don't see how we can divorce

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first-person experience from

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consciousness and study consciousness

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from solely a third-person account so I

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believe that we have evidence to think

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that way thank you we have a few minutes

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for questions and comments and I will

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exert chairs privilege just for just to

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comment that relying on string theory to

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give us an idea of the true nature of

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physics is seems to be getting

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increasingly dodgy these days to spend

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despite the best propaganda efforts of

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folks like Brian Greene let me add one

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idea to that Brian Greene taught me

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indirectly through television that M

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theory summarizes the five subservient

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variants of string theory unifies them

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and predicts a fourth spatial dimension

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so I believe that my ideas are evidence

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of his theory but he was not interested

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in that kind of evidence ah I see a

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hi Bernie Bernie Williams first I want

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to agree with York and then I want agree

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with you and then I want to note that a

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lot of the inner subjective turn that

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we're taking has to do with reviving

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ancient traditions like Maria does and

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to note that I don't think it's ironic

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that we have one and only one remaining

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fragment from the cheapest now for those

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of you who aren't antique Greeks the

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cheapest was Democritus teacher the

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proposer of atoms all right

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what is the one remaining fragment a

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description of particles of newest

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particles of mind I am assuming I don't

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have to answer that comments would be

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welcome however I'm not sure I know how

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to comment on that

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why not Costa I'm a neurophysiologist

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does consciousness studies now and I

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like exploring altered states and

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recording them on the EEG so try this

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one on the brain is a quantum mechanical

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electrochemical meat machine that

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collapses the wavefunction and then if

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you want to get even more confused what

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we're all doing here is our brains are

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studying our brains and our brains are

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studying our consciousness so you can

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never get out of the problem of the

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brain is part of the the mix I started

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going to the consciousness the science

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of cautions conferences years ago and

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all these debates happened every day and

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and then different camps were formed the

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neuro phenomenologist the nerve net

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people the modelers the subjective

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experience people you have to look at

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the whole gamut so I encourage people to

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explore altered states of consciousness

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where you can have these experiences of

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out-of-body you can have

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these experiences of your consciousness

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moved to different locations you can

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have telepathic well no some of this

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thank you for a beautiful presentation

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other questions

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[Laughter]

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unicrone I wonder if you know that in

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Kabbalistic science there was already

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super string theory in which science

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Kabbalistic science no you know you can

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read it in read in the book of dr.

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pollidori published in 1925 it says that

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all universe including physical

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substance has created from primal

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vibrations of two types one is like

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snake swallowing its own tail which is

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closed-loop stream right and another

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unrestricted in vibrations of these two

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or two types of strings make the whole

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world so this is pretty interesting that

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they knew about it very interesting

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thank you